elder (of the community)

The Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek that is typically translated as “elders” in English is translated in the Danish Bibelen 2020 as folkets ledere or “leaders of the people.”

Martin Ehrensvärd, one of the translators, explains: “The term ‘elder’ turned out to pose a particularly thorny problem. In traditional bibles, you can find elders all of over the place and they never pose a problem for a translator, they are just always elders. But how to find a contemporary term for this semi-official, complex position? This may have been our longest-standing problem. A couple of times we thought we had the solution, and then implemented it throughout the texts, only to find out that it didn’t work. Like when we used city council or village council, depending on the context. In the end we felt that the texts didn’t work with such official terms, and throughout the years in the desert, these terms didn’t make much sense. Other suggestions were ‘the eldest and wisest’, ‘the respected citizens’, ‘the Israelites with a certain position in society’, ‘the elder council’ –- and let me point out that these terms sound better in Danish than in English (‘de fremtrædende borgere,’ ‘de mest fremtrædende israelitter,’ ‘alle israelitter med en vis position,’ ‘de ældste og de klogeste,’ ‘ældsterådet’). In the end we just said ‘leaders of the people.’ After a lot of hand-wringing, it turned out that we actually found a term that worked well. So, we had to give up conveying the fact that they were old, but the most important point is that they were community leaders.” (Source: Ehrensvärd in HIPHIL Novum 8/2023, p. 81ff. )

The German das Buch translation by Roland Werner (publ. 2009-2022) translates likewise as “leader of the people” (Anführer des Volkes).

complete verse (Joel 1:2)

Following are a number of back-translations as well as a sample translation for translators of Joel 1:2:

  • Kupsabiny: “Listen, oh my elders
    and hear, oh my community.
    This is a word/matter that has not happened any other day to you (plur.)
    and your grandfathers have not seen.” (Source: Kupsabiny Back Translation)
  • Newari: “Hey you elders! Listen!
    All you people living in the land of Judah, give ear with proper attention!
    Has ever such a thing happened in your days
    or in the days of your forefather?” (Source: Newari Back Translation)
  • Hiligaynon: “You (plur.) rulers of Juda and all its residents, [you (plur.)] listen to this which I will-tell you (plur.). Nothing yet has-happened like this (which happened) during the time of your (plur.) ancestors or during your (plur.) time now.” (Source: Hiligaynon Back Translation)
  • Kankanaey: “Listen to this that I say, you older-men and all people here-in Juda. Please think if there-is something-like this that happened in your time or in the time of your ancestors.” (Source: Kankanaey Back Translation)

formal 2nd person plural pronoun (Japanese)

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Like a number of other East Asian languages, Japanese uses a complex system of honorifics, i.e. a system where a number of different levels of politeness are expressed in language via words, word forms or grammatical constructs. These can range from addressing someone or referring to someone with contempt (very informal) to expressing the highest level of reference (as used in addressing or referring to God) or any number of levels in-between.

One way Japanese shows different degree of politeness is through the choice of a formal plural suffix to the second person pronoun (“you” and its various forms) as shown here in the widely-used Japanese Shinkaiyaku (新改訳) Bible of 2017. In these verses, anata-gata (あなたがた) is used, combining the second person pronoun anata and the plural suffix -gata to create a formal plural pronoun (“you” [plural] in English).

(Source: S. E. Doi, see also S. E. Doi in Journal of Translation, 18/2022, p. 37ff. )

Translation commentary on Joel 1:2

Hear this, you aged men, give ear, all inhabitants of the land!: These two parallel lines are similar in meaning. The commands Hear this and give ear show that this prophecy was spoken and not only written down. These commands refer to what the prophet is about to say. Give ear renders a Hebrew idiom that simply means “listen” (Good News Translation). It also implies that the hearers were to think about, or consider, the significance of what was said. If an idiomatic expression can be used for give ear, that will be better; for example, “open your ears.” Good News Translation changes the order of the parts in the second line. In some languages it will be more natural to leave the order as it is in the Hebrew and start with the verb in the imperative, just as in the first line. If the parallelism of these two lines can not be maintained, it may be better to use only one verb; for example, they may be rendered “Listen to what I am going to say, you old people and everyone [else] in Judah.”

The Hebrew word for aged men is rendered “elders” in the sense of leaders of the people by the New Revised Standard Version (New Revised Standard Version) and New English Bible. Contemporary English Version says “leaders.” Some scholars believe it is better to understand the word as referring to old men or old people, as do Revised Standard Version and Good News Translation, since the prophet asks them about their experience of the past. However, the elders had become prominent officials in this period after the Exile. When Joel adds the second command in line two, he does not address “young people,” as if in contrast to the elderly, but addresses all the inhabitants of the land. Therefore it seems better to understand the “elders” as the leaders of the people in line one, with the command shifting from the leaders to the whole population in line two. In many cultures “elders” are the main leaders, so a rendering of aged men will carry both senses.

Inhabitants of the land refers to everyone in general who was living in Judah. Because the Temple is in a prominent position during the plague of locusts (1.13; 2.1), and because “Judah and Jerusalem” are mentioned specifically in 3.1, the land is no doubt the land of “Judah” (Good News Translation) in southern Palestine.

Has such a thing happened in your days, or in the days of your fathers?: This is a rhetorical question that expects the answer “No.” Rhetorical questions are usually used to make an emphatic statement, so this one may be understood to say “No locust attack as destructive as this one has ever happened in Judah.” The answer may have to be supplied in languages that do not naturally accept rhetorical questions. Alternatively, it will be quite acceptable to translate “Such a thing has never happened in your time or that of your fathers,” even though this rendering may not have the same impact.

Such a thing (Good News Translation “anything like this”) clearly refers to the disaster caused by the locusts, and this may need to be stated clearly in some languages. However, translators should avoid being too explicit at this point, since keeping people in suspense does contribute to the impact of this statement. They may say “Has such a disaster ever happened to you or your forefathers?”

In your days and in the days of your fathers render common Hebrew idioms meaning “during the time that you have lived” and “during the times past when your fathers lived.” For in your days, Die Bibel im heutigen Deutsch has “your lifetime,” and Segond says “your times.” The Hebrew word translated fathers often includes grandfathers, great-grandfathers, and even earlier “ancestors,” as Good News Translation has it, so Joel is implying that no similar disaster has struck since God’s people inhabited Judah. Many languages are similar to Hebrew by including ancestors in their word for “father” or “grandfather” (so Swahili).

Quoted with permission from de Blois, Kees & Dorn, Louis. A Handbook on Joel. (UBS Helps for Translators). Miami: UBS, 2020. For this and other handbooks for translators see here .